50 Year of Women's Right to Choose Gone

[Paige]

I can't say that I am against keeping the federal government out of medicine, but I don't see the good in a ruling that basically just makes a medical procedure illegal for potentially half the nation.  This just seems like an odd stretch to go from  "everyone has this right" to "some people can vote to have the right" and then push the move was for freedom and individual rights.

[MissBarbara]

May I reiterate a point?
 
Justice Ginsburg on her nomination and sitting before the committee said that Roe was bad law, as it removed the legislative process, meaning, it forced people to accept it.

That's the third time you've cited Justice Gunsburg on this topic, and all three times you missed her point.

Ginsburg was in no way a supporter of strict state rights, and she was a strong supporter of substantive due process (as can be seen in her votes and concurring opinions on both the Lawrence and Obergefell decisions).

Gindburg's main concerns were that the Roe decision did not focus on a woman's choice. The focus of the decision was on the unenumerated right to privacy.
She also asserted that abortion rights should have been the fruit of gradual change, a process that included, the courts, the states, and, if necessary, the federal government. Her main point was that Roe was too far-reaching and too all-encompassing, thereby setting up the decision to be overturned at a future date. Given Friday's decision, she was perfectly on point.

I haven't the slightest disagreement with your and Sheila's assertion, "This is no ones business but the woman, her partner, and if needed, her doctor's."

However, in context, that is an opinion, and the point is that if that opinion is to be protected under law, then change must be affected on the political basis -- keeping a Democrat in the White House, enuring Democratic majorities in Congress, ensuring Democratic governors and Democratic majorities in state assemblies, etc.

I am aware that KB is an opinion board, and expressing opinions here is the whole point. But opinions on both sides of this topic have been loudly and longly expressed for close to 50 years, and amping up the expression of opinions -- here and elsewhere -- affects no change whatsoever.

[MissBarbara]

and now the people can have a voice in it, instead of leaving it to the asshats in charge.

I still love and respect you all.

After MissB schooled me, I'm feeling quite the dumbass right now and probably just just keep my head down here, but here goes nothing...

The people don't have a voice.  Wisconsin banned abortion even though 53% of adults in Wisconsin (the majority) believe that abortion should be legal. Ok, so we have a voice, but it's being outright ignored.

I voted for Evers too.  Goes to show if you vote Republican, they think they own you and screw you, you vote Democrat, they think they own you and screw you.

Sheila, I owe you an apology.

My intent was not to school you, correct you, say you were wrong, or challenge your intelligence or insight.

Your voice on this topic -- and every other topic -- is at least as resonant as mine, at least as meaningful as mine, and at least as germane as mine.

My only point, as I alluded to in my response to WB a minute ago, is that Roe v. Wade was overturned via an established process, and states that have or shortly will enact restrictive anti-abortion laws, are also doing so via established processes.

This points to -- and this is certainly an opinion! -- a fundamental flaw in our Federalist system of government, and the fruit of the Dobbs decision points out that flaw.

The biggest question is this: What are we going to do about it?

Justices Thomas and Alito have made it perfectly clear that they will fight to overturn decisions relating to the legality of birth control, same-sex relations, and same-sex marriage. And it is clear that they currently have the votes to do so. Even after Ketanji Brown Jackson takes her seat on the COurt in the next week or so, the conservatives will retain their 6-3 majority.

At the risk of sounding like Polyanna, we, the people, have the power to affect change. It's an almost insuperable challenge, but it still lies in our hands. Throwing up ones hands by asserting that we, the people, are powerless affects no change whatsoever.

[Writers Bloque]

and now the people can have a voice in it, instead of leaving it to the asshats in charge.

I still love and respect you all.

After MissB schooled me, I'm feeling quite the dumbass right now and probably just just keep my head down here, but here goes nothing...

The people don't have a voice.  Wisconsin banned abortion even though 53% of adults in Wisconsin (the majority) believe that abortion should be legal. Ok, so we have a voice, but it's being outright ignored.

I voted for Evers too.  Goes to show if you vote Republican, they think they own you and screw you, you vote Democrat, they think they own you and screw you.

Sheila, I owe you an apology.

My intent was not to school you, correct you, say you were wrong, or challenge your intelligence or insight.

Your voice on this topic -- and every other topic -- is at least as resonant as mine, at least as meaningful as mine, and at least as germane as mine.

My only point, as I alluded to in my response to WB a minute ago, is that Roe v. Wade was overturned via an established process, and states that have or shortly will enact restrictive anti-abortion laws, are also doing so via established processes.

This points to -- and this is certainly an opinion! -- a fundamental flaw in our Federalist system of government, and the fruit of the Dobbs decision points out that flaw.

The biggest question is this: What are we going to do about it?

Justices Thomas and Alito have made it perfectly clear that they will fight to overturn decisions relating to the legality of birth control, same-sex relations, and same-sex marriage. And it is clear that they currently have the votes to do so. Even after Ketanji Brown Jackson takes her seat on the COurt in the next week or so, the conservatives will retain their 6-3 majority.

At the risk of sounding like Polyanna, we, the people, have the power to affect change. It's an almost insuperable challenge, but it still lies in our hands. Throwing up ones hands by asserting that we, the people, are powerless affects no change whatsoever.

MissBarbara, Thank you for the clarification. Although we disagree on this and maybe other issues, you among a few others posting in this thread actually make sound arguments, instead of telling me to continuously fuck myself (no jab at PH, he is still cool in my book.) That was my point all along, we now have the power to change it for either good or bad. Despite the many glaring flaws in our systems of government. Thank you from the bottom of my heart for the information. The beautiful Irony of it all was that it took a woman to tell men their plan would eventually fail, and also her fighting the military on forcing women to get abortions to stay in the military, that's the best kind of ballsy.

[MissBarbara]

MissBarbara, Thank you for the clarification. Although we disagree on this and maybe other issues, you among a few others posting in this thread actually make sound arguments, instead of telling me to continuously fuck myself (no jab at PH, he is still cool in my book.) That was my point all along, we now have the power to change it for either good or bad. Despite the many glaring flaws in our systems of government. Thank you from the bottom of my heart for the information. The beautiful Irony of it all was that it took a woman to tell men their plan would eventually fail, and also her fighting the military on forcing women to get abortions to stay in the military, that's the best kind of ballsy.

I would much more strongly prefer to have a calm, reasoned, and cordial discussion than a flame war (or pee war).

Yet, this is 1408, where flame wars, pee wars, degradation, and telling people to go fuck themselves is expressly permitted.

[Shiela_M]

I'm not sour at you missB. You pointed out that I was wrong and that's it. I didnt take offense, I'm just embarrassed that I made such a sweeping claim without doing the research. It's just that I feel stupid, not that you made me look stupid. Your correct me, or schooled me, that's it. No apology is needed at all.

Keep doing what you do, I love it, we all do. Like a lioness waiting in the grass for ignorance to walk by and then you pounce.

Here's another instance of my utter idiocy. I said Evers made abortions illegal, but in fact it's because of an law established in 1849, and Evers is trying to fight it. He is granting clemency for any physician that is found to be performing abortions. I'm just going to sit quietly and follow what the smarter people are doing.

[Pornhubby]

Reproductive rights is such an emotional topic that, if it is difficult to be objective about it, it is impossible to change anyone else’s opinion about it. I was so distraught on Friday, that I felt physically ill and had to go home. I was dry heaving and having chest pains. And I popped off a few comments here that I probably regret. I meant no one offense, please just recognize I was very upset by the ruling, and particularly by the rationale for the ruling. Because everything from access to contraceptives to gay marriage is now in the crosshairs. This is just the first of a number of very disturbing opinions we should anticipate from this court.

[MissBarbara]

I'm not sour at you missB. You pointed out that I was wrong and that's it. I didnt take offense, I'm just embarrassed that I made such a sweeping claim without doing the research. It's just that I feel stupid, not that you made me look stupid. Your correct me, or schooled me, that's it. No apology is needed at all.

Keep doing what you do, I love it, we all do. Like a lioness waiting in the grass for ignorance to walk by and then you pounce.

Here's another instance of my utter idiocy. I said Evers made abortions illegal, but in fact it's because of an law established in 1849, and Evers is trying to fight it. He is granting clemency for any physician that is found to be performing abortions. I'm just going to sit quietly and follow what the smarter people are doing.

It's neither ignorance nor idiocy.

There are a couple of areas that I am very interested in and knowledgeable about. This happens to be one of them.

Otherwise, there's a very long list of areas that I'm fairly ignorant about, including almost everything related to science and technology, the fine arts, popular culture, and sports, among others.

For the record, I'd prefer to be referred to as a tigress rather than a lioness. Lionesses hunt in packs; tigresses hunt alone.

[Pornhubby]

Student-athletes in Alabama now have to report information about their periods on physical evaluation forms in order to play a sport.

The question is one of 17 on the standard Alabama High School Athletic Association form. It is not marked as optional. Other questions cover a student’s medical and surgical history.

“There are many reasons why a young woman might not be having a regular or recent menstrual cycle. Few of those reasons would have any bearing on whether she’s eligible to compete in athletics,” said Dr. Leslie Evans, an OBGYN with Fairhope Gynecology and Obstetrics.

The Alabama High School Athletic Association physical evaluation form is required for all high school athletes whose schools are members of the association. Along with questions about medical conditions, the form includes questions about when a student had their first and last menstrual cycle and the longest time between periods.

Evans said she believes the question doesn’t need to be asked at all, and could be both invasive and discriminatory.

[Guy Fawkes]

I'm not American, and I generally don't tend to comment overly much on American politics, but I will say this much:

Republicans seem to have problem with obscenity -- you saw this during both the Reagan and Bush Jr. Administrations.  The McCoy and Fletcher cases both began when George W. Bush was in office.

The law that was used to convict Fletcher, McCoy & Arthur (Mr. Double)  will, I believe, also be used in prosecuting women who are attempting to obtain information on abortions.  Just look at the wording of the statute:

§1462. Importation or transportation of obscene matters

Whoever brings into the United States, or any place subject to the jurisdiction thereof, or knowingly uses any express company or other common carrier or interactive computer service (as defined in section 230(e)(2) 1 of the Communications Act of 1934), for carriage in interstate or foreign commerce—

(a) any obscene, lewd, lascivious, or filthy book, pamphlet, picture, motion-picture film, paper, letter, writing, print, or other matter of indecent character; or

(b) any obscene, lewd, lascivious, or filthy phonograph recording, electrical transcription, or other article or thing capable of producing sound; or

(c) any drug, medicine, article, or thing designed, adapted, or intended for producing abortion, or for any indecent or immoral use; or any written or printed card, letter, circular, book, pamphlet, advertisement, or notice of any kind giving information, directly or indirectly, where, how, or of whom, or by what means any of such mentioned articles, matters, or things may be obtained or made; or

I wouldn't be the least bit surprised to see the above weaponized against abortion activists.