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BLM Demonstrations, Riots, Police Brutality, Justice for George Floyd

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Offline MissBarbara

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Reply #240 on: August 27, 2020, 05:56:44 PM

It's been a long, hot summer. Reminiscent of the summer of 1968. Protesters clashing with police in most major urban areas. Looting. Burning. Peaceful protests suddenly turning violent. Fifty-two years later. Nothing has changed, it seems.


There's a mythology that the Right has developed that purports that major cities across the country -- most of them with Democratic mayors -- are scenes of looting, burning, violent protests, occupations, and the like. Just read Joan's posts and you'll see that I mean.

Thier logic goes something like: Major cities across the U.S. are burning to the ground, those cities have Democratic mayors, Joe Biden is a Democrat, therefore Joe Biden supports "looting, burning, violent protests, occupations, and the like," and, if elected, Joe Biden will burn your city to the ground.

The mainstream news media, exhausted with months of almost exclusively covering the effects of the COVID-19 pandemic in the U.S., leapt at the chance of focusing on something else, and something much more exciting. So we're treated to daily helpings across all media of scenes like these:










"They" are burning America to the ground! Violence, arson and looting has become the norm! No one is safe!

All of those pictures are real, and they depict real events. But it seems that the Right has succeeded in changing the narrative, and BLM protests and marches -- relatively common acts of civil obedience that have been a staple in the U.S. for several centuries -- have become linked to the "looting, burning, violent protests, occupations, and the like," even though those acts are being carried out by two almost completely separate groups of people.

I recall reading back in June a piece written by a local NYC news reporter whose apartment was near the site of both protests and looting/arson during the few days when their was a curfew in the city. She described, from looking out her window, how it grew closer to 10:00 pm, most of the protestors began packing up and heading off to the subways to return home. Then, about an hour later, the rioting, vandalism, looting, and arson began, carried out by people who simply took advantage of the fact of the protests to carry out their criminal activities.

All of this is by way of saying please don't feed the Right's false narrative! Please don't confuse the fact that the "looting, burning, violent protests, occupations, and the like" is not being carried out by BLM protestors or other "leftists," but by common criminals.

In a very real way, it's NOTHING like 1968. At that point, large areas of U.S. cities did "burn to the ground," political and civil rights leaders were murdered, the DNC convention was a scene of chaos and mass arrests, and the lines between legitimate civil disobedience and criminal looting and rioting were hopelessly blurred.









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Offline joan1984

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Reply #241 on: August 27, 2020, 06:34:33 PM
  ...Do not believe your own "lying eyes"...

The "largely peaceful" protestors have nothing to do with the burning, looting, stealing, murder and mayhem you are seeing in American cities, and towns.

JoE Biden only says he supports such activity, and he is not responsible for anything he says... or has said... ever... as we all know.

Do not worry that the "largely peaceful" protests will be coming for you next...

Glad we got that all sorted...

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Offline MissBarbara

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Reply #242 on: August 27, 2020, 07:53:24 PM

  JoE Biden only says he supports such activity, and he is not responsible for anything he says... or has said... ever... as we all know.


As you know, JoE Biden never said anything of the sort.

And as I noted above, JoE Biden is not (yet) the president. If you believe, as you have several times implied, that the U.S. president shares blame or responsibility for what has been going on, then please place the blame and responsibility at the feet of the man who is, in fact, the U.S. president.





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Offline watcher1

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Reply #243 on: August 27, 2020, 08:05:10 PM
The nightly news showing the looting and violence is playing right into Trump's hands. Fits right into his Law and Order campaign. I can imagine what people who live in rural areas or small towns think when scenes such as these are on the news every evening.  Sadly for most of America, the Trump campaign couldn't have scripted it any better.

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Offline Athos_131

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Reply #244 on: August 27, 2020, 11:35:47 PM

#BlackLivesMatter

#BanTheNaziFromKB

#BlackLivesMatter
Arrest The Cops Who Killed Breonna Taylor

#BanTheNaziFromKB


Offline joan1984

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Reply #245 on: August 28, 2020, 12:39:05 AM
  What came first?

  The looting and violence, or the nightly news?

  Not only rural citizens, and citizens in small towns, are watching... those in cities and suburbs, especially, are watching the looting and mobs threatening small businesses, and threatening homes, and are alarmed, rightly so...

  Citizens are asking "who has our backs... who has our interests...

  Citizens are seeing, clearly, who does not. Seeing clearly who is endorsing, encouraging, agreeing, nodding along, and promoting, mobs and illegal action.

  All watching know the vulnerability of their own local area, their own property, their own families, homes, places they shop, places they work and earn their livings... Seeing more clearly who will protect their futures...

  Voters are watching, some wringing hands, others making safety plans.

  Vote Republican, November 3, 2020. Vote America's Future...


The nightly news showing the looting and violence is playing right into Trump's hands. Fits right into his Law and Order campaign. I can imagine what people who live in rural areas or small towns think when scenes such as these are on the news every evening.  Sadly for most of America, the Trump campaign couldn't have scripted it any better.

Some people are like the 'slinky'. Not really good for much,
but they bring a smile to your face as they fall down stairs.


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Reply #246 on: August 28, 2020, 12:47:23 AM
 
 
Vote Republican, November 3, 2020. Vote America's Future...







Offline Lois

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Reply #247 on: August 28, 2020, 06:53:22 AM
Trump is the cause of all of this.  He's been encouraging right-wing violence all along, and we are simply tired of his shit.



Offline joan1984

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Reply #248 on: August 30, 2020, 01:01:26 PM
 ...“If we tear it up, we have nothing,” Blake Sr. said. “I don’t want you all to be homeless. I don’t want you to be store-less. I don’t want you not to be able to buy your sons, daughters and grandbabies the food and the milk that they need ... show them for one night, we don’t have to tear up nothing.”
 
 Jacom Blake, Sr. at a peaceful assembly in Kennosha, Wisconsin. 8/29/2020


https://www.jsonline.com/story/news/2020/08/29/kenosha-updates-latest-jacob-blake-police-shooting-kyle-rittenhouse-protest-deaths/5670389002/

  Since adequate utilization of National Guard Troops (President Trump authorized up to 2000 National Guard Soldiers, with agreement of Wisconsin's Governor, following days of violent demonstrations, looting, fires and several deaths, as some demonstrators assaulted civilians seeking to defend local businesses from arson and looting.)

  President Trump plans to visit with the National Guard there, as well as w/citizens and business owners, and no doubt local officials, following three nights of peace.

Some people are like the 'slinky'. Not really good for much,
but they bring a smile to your face as they fall down stairs.


_priapism

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Reply #249 on: August 30, 2020, 02:23:32 PM
I have a radical idea. Why don’t we just not shoot black men in the back seven times in the first place? That seems a lot easier than deploying 2000 National Guardsmen to suppress protest.
« Last Edit: August 30, 2020, 02:54:03 PM by ToeinH2O »



Offline joan1984

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Reply #250 on: August 30, 2020, 04:05:11 PM
I have a radical idea. Why don’t we just not shoot black men in the back seven times in the first place? That seems a lot easier than deploying 2000 National Guardsmen to suppress protest.
The suspect refused cooperation, displayed a knife, refused orders to drop the weapon, was 'Tazed' multiple times without apparent effects, continued to resist arrest, and reached inside a motor vehicle while resisting, ignoring Police warnings, all caught on video by a bystander.

  The Officer who used a service weapon to stop the resisting, threatening armed suspect, believed was following existing official Kenosha, WI Police procedures, by preventing the armed, resisting suspect from possible access to a firearm, and to a motor vehicle, so as to use such vehicle as a weapon, and/or attempt his escape.

  All previous attempts to question, and restrain this armed suspect were deployed and in turn, each failed. The suspect was imminently to be in control of weapons (potential firearm, other weaponry, 3000 pound plus motor vehicle), resisted hand intervention to restrain while in the vehicle doorway, and was stopped by potential lethal firearm use, prior to being arrested, and given medical treatment by the very Officers who arrested the subject.

  A formal inquiry is under way, to include the Officer who affected the STOP of the offender/suspect, and his arrest at the site. Other Officers and witnesses will no doubt be interviewed.

  The Kenosha, WI rules for prohibiting a armed suspect from gaining further weaponry access, and/or motor vehicle access for potential use as a weapon, or as a means for a armed resisting suspect to flee, will no doubt be detailed, as to the actions of the arrest team, and reviewed by lawmakers as may be determined.

  Police Actions, interactions of felons with Police, interactions of armed suspects with Police, are all subject to existing laws, with penalties for Police misconduct, and with Defense Attorneys supplied upon request for perpetrator, to assist and/or argue the Defense case, to insure the individual is given all due rights in court.

  Such Defense Attorneys are respected as Officers Of The Court, by one or another similar phrasing, and make it their business to defend suspects to the best of their ability.

  Most Defense Attorneys would advise a client to not resist arrest, comply with the law, and comply with arresting or other Police requests/orders, to affect a more civil interaction between all residents, citizens and Police alike.

  The Official Inquiry will address this arrest, in detail. No LOOTING or mob violence is necessary or desired, or LEGAL, and such violent mob behavior puts individuals at risk, subject to arrest and incarceration, under applicable law.

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but they bring a smile to your face as they fall down stairs.


Offline Athos_131

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Reply #251 on: August 30, 2020, 06:55:29 PM
The suspect refused cooperation, displayed a knife, refused orders to drop the weapon,

You have proof of this, correct?

Show your work.

#BlackLivesMatter

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Offline Athos_131

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Reply #252 on: August 30, 2020, 07:12:57 PM
I have a radical idea. Why don’t we just not shoot black men in the back seven times in the first place? That seems a lot easier than deploying 2000 National Guardsmen to suppress protest.

Why not both?  

Gotta keep peace in the Florida of the Midwest.  Can't let those filthy minorities have any rights.  The constitution wasn't originally designed to protect them anyway.

#BlackLivesMatter

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Hard_as_ironman

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Reply #253 on: August 30, 2020, 07:20:01 PM
 Since adequate utilization of National Guard Troops (President Trump authorized up to 2000 National Guard Soldiers, with agreement of Wisconsin's Governor, following days of violent demonstrations, looting, fires and several deaths, as some demonstrators assaulted civilians seeking to defend local businesses from arson and looting.)

  President Trump plans to visit with the National Guard there, as well as w/citizens and business owners, and no doubt local officials, following three nights of peace.[/color]

The state government doesnt need authorization from the federal government or trump to activate its national guard soldiers.  So saying trump authorized 2000 is a moot point, and only added to make it look as if trump was making the decision.  You're just adding that so you can later give trump credit if things calm down.  Trump can activate whatever he wants, for overseas use, but the governor has say over what happens in his/her state.  I will agree that I think Wisconsin governor was a little slow to react, but I think it's because he doesn't want to look like trump and just throw the military at his own citizens.



Offline eater

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Reply #254 on: September 01, 2020, 03:30:30 PM
just because the democrats didnt win the last election or because they dont like our president is no excuse for allowing the destruction of neighborhoods and lives of innocent hard working people.
we are all americans and this is OUR country, not trumps or bidens or obamas.

i dont particularly like trump either , but i dont want to date him or marry him or live with him either!
he was hired to do a job, period.
he gave all his salary away to charity he made everyones 401k do very good, he made more african americans employed than any time in history, ok good.
he made more hispanics employed than ever in history, good for him.
he saved our farmers and timber industry and dairy industry from other countries screwing them on imports, good..same for cheap dumped steel from countries where govt subsidies give them unfair advantages over our steel industry..good deal.

he's doing great overall as far as his JOB goes, i dont CARE if he is not jesus in the flesh or the greatest man on earth. and i dont care if he is repub. dem. or independent as long as he is making the country do good and trying his best to keep our country strong. its a scary world out there as anyone who has lived in other countries will tell you.
we dont need a weak nice friendly guy to run things or shmooze..we need someone rude blunt and to the point and gets things done.

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Offline Jed_

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Reply #255 on: September 01, 2020, 04:16:34 PM
Trump is in charge idiot, and he is deliberately fanning the flames, so you are very confused on who’s ‘allowing’ it.



Offline eater

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Reply #256 on: September 01, 2020, 05:01:53 PM
Trump is in charge idiot, and he is deliberately fanning the flames, so you are very confused on who’s ‘allowing’ it.

there is no need for disrespectful name calling, i am not an idiot any more than you or anyone else in here.

the president, be he obama or biden or trump is the "executive branch" of the "federal government"...  here In the united states we have a system set up of 3 branches of government the others are the "judicial" and the "legislative" branches.

President Trump is not allowed to march into cities or states with our armed forces to control criminal activity even if its as serious as arson and murder of police officers and citizens taking place in some democratic run areas now.
He must defer to the states as he is federal...the easiest way to explain it is he is not a dictator and is not " IN CHARGE " as you say. the mayors of the cities where the crime sprees are occurring are responsible to put a stop to it with the city police and the governors of those states are supposed to work with those mayors to support them with state police.
i dont know what you mean by "fanning it"  i have seen CNN and other outlets glorifying some of the crimes and having guest speakers who support the criminals position or at least excuse the crimes due to their emotional state, but i have only heard the president speak against the crimes sprees and plead for peace and a stop to the criminal activities.

if you see any other areas where you think i may be confused please bring them to my attention, thank you.

"The era of Gaslighting"


Offline Jed_

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Reply #257 on: September 02, 2020, 05:26:26 AM


if you see any other areas where you think i may be confused please bring them to my attention, thank you.


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Reply #258 on: September 25, 2020, 02:17:00 AM


Love Chief Craig.  I also Love the Mayor of Detroit.  They've done a great job over the past several months.


Detroit Police Chief Explains the Real Issue Behind Riots – and It's Not Race



DETROIT, Mich. – Detroit Police Chief James Craig told Townhall in an exclusive interview that the unrest that's taking place across the nation has less to do with race relations and is more about a radical faction of people attempting to undermine the government.

"I can tell you that this group that's marching, like so many across the country, the anarchist factions of these groups are promoting violence and attacks on police officers. They don't speak for Detroit," he told Townhall. "And I recognize that it's not all of the protestors it's the core, that little small group, that really tries to create violence."

According to Craig, Detroiters have helped prevent groups like Black Lives Matter from causing chaos and destruction in the city .

"I can tell you: Detroiters don't like it. They support this chief. They support this police department. They do not support defunding [the police]," he explained. "They know what defunding looks like."

When Craig was appointed seven-and-a-half years ago, "police officers lost 10 percent of their pay as the city was rapidly approaching municipal bankruptcy, which ultimately happened."

"Detroiters don't support [defunding] and police officers don't support it," he said. "And I absolutely don't support it."

Craig, who was has had a long career in law enforcement, has been part of departments in various cities. He previously served as Chief of Police in Cincinnati, Ohio and Portland, Maine. He was also an officer with the Los Angeles Police Department for 28 years.

The biggest difference between Detroit and other cities across the nation, like Portland and Seattle, according to Craig, is the lack of support from city officials.

"The mayor here in Detroit has confidence in my experience and my ability to do the job," Craig told Townhall. "He trusts that. We talk about different issues, but, at the end of the day, he trusts me to make the right decision. And, frankly, he has as little tolerance as I do with violence, violent attacks on police officers, destroying property. [Mayor Mike] Duggan and I are in lockstep."

In other cities, chiefs are afraid to stand up to things they believe is wrong because law enforcement officials are at odds with city leaders.

"How do you allow someone to set up a no cop zone, an area of lawlessness?" he asked rhetorically, referring to Seattle's CHOP/CHAZ zone.

"When they tried that ridiculous move here in Detroit, the message was clear: you're not going to set up a zone and make demands," Craig explained.

When rioters attempted to create a zone in Detroit, police immediately arrested people. The message was apparent: lawlessness and violence wouldn't be tolerated.

"Because of our firm stand, this department has won tremendous praise from not only our residents but also folks in metro Detroit. I get tremendous support from my colleagues across the state – and across the country – for standing up and speaking out in a bold, fearless way, that we're not putting up with this," Craig explained.

One of the concerns Americans have is whether or not this violent movement is going to come to their city. Areas that traditionally don't have officer-involved shooting or destruction are feeling the impact of the Black Lives Matter movement. With riots breaking out in smaller cities and towns, like Kenosha, Wisconsin and Lancaster, Pennsylvania, the fear is justified.

"This is happening all across America. There's an uptick in violence. A lot of it has to do with the uptick in anti-police rhetoric and criminals are now feeling emboldened to be aggressive and attack police officers," the chief explained.

The middle ground that Americans and law enforcement can come to, according to Craig, is simple: officers can make it clear they support a person's First Amendment right to peacefully protest.

"What's non-negotiable is violent attacks against police officers," he explained. "Most Americans would agree with that."

Law enforcement leaders should not waiver on what they expect of protestors. Setting buildings and property ablaze, taking over the streets, and making demands are non-negotiable, Craig told Townhall.

"As a country, we have to stand firm in our resolve. We have to be unified and work together," he said. Regardless of where a person stands politically – whether left, right or in the center – and what race we are, Craig said Americans should come together to condemn violence.

"We support our men and women in uniform and, of course, in cases when an officer exceeds his authority and uses excessive force, we hold that person accountable," the chief explained. "That does not reflect the entire profession."

Craig also said the other thing that should not be tolerated are "radicals" manipulating facts surrounding an instance to incite violence.

As cities across the nation look at diversifying their police forces, Craig pointed out that departments should be reflective of the demographic they serve. The one thing that we're seeing today are mayors and radicals calling on police chiefs to resign, regardless of their race or sex.

"Race doesn't matter," Craig explained. "What matters to them is someone who speaks truth against what their narrative is [which is that] they're peacefully protesting, which isn't always the case."

"The real issue is not as much about the race," the chief said. "The anarchists and the Marxist Ideology, they have no support for anybody in government. They want to undermine that so it doesn't matter what race your race is. It's less about that."

"We've seen an exit of African American chiefs, some white chiefs, female chiefs. It just doesn't matter," Craig concluded.



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Offline Lois

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Reply #259 on: September 25, 2020, 06:06:09 AM
That's prety much spot-on.

Police departments don't need defunding, but some might need reformed to remove the bad apples.

Good cops should support reforms, because a bad cop places a target on all cops.  All of the  Tucson Police Officers are professional and a credit to their profession.  I wish I could say the same for the Sherriffs department here.