Does God exist?

[Poppet]

I believe in god and I also believe he gave up on us along time ago. Seriouly people why would our creator continue to waste his time on us? All we do is commit sin after sin day after day. Luckily the devil still cares about us.

hang on.. I RECOGNIZE that avatar..... Watcher, baby, are you double dipping???

mmm freshly-dipped Watcher....

P

[Vela Nanashi]

The avatar is one of the board default ones, it has a large selection, not everyone gets theirs from elsewhere or makes one of their own.

[hugo]

who am i to tell....its up too you to decide if he does

[Bexy]

[watcher1]

hang on.. I RECOGNIZE that avatar..... Watcher, baby, are you double dipping???

mmm freshly-dipped Watcher....

P

I thought he looked familiar also.  Hmmm, will you be the one dipping me, G? 

[enchantedpagan012]

To some degree i believe.

[Katiebee]

Toe, I've got to points.

First Jesus isn't God and he specifically said so.

Fir the main point, If God doesn't exist this is all moot. If God does exist all of our arguing about Him is moot.

Just because He hasn't directly intervened like in the Old Testament does't mean he doesn't Exist. You can't see a molecule but that doesn't mean they don't exist.

As I see it most of this argument hinges on two facts: that some people need others to validate their beliefs by participating in them, and some people don't want to participate.

[MissBarbara]

Yes, God exists. He told me so this morning.

[Katiebee]

Yes, God exists. He told me so this morning.

And there you have it.

Miss Barbara wouldn't lie to me.

[enchantedpagan012]

Yes, God exists. He told me so this morning.

Did you see the figure of jesus in your waffles? 

[MissBarbara]

Yes, God exists. He told me so this morning.

Did you see the figure of jesus in your waffles? 

After reading the post above, I thought Jesus wasn't God. I am soooooo confused....

[enchantedpagan012]

Actually the fundamental belief of Christianity is the divinity of Christ.  The first big doctrinal dispute in the 4th century, with the rise of Arianism, was "Is Christ God?  Or was he man?"

St. Athanasius of Alexandria famously said, "God became man, so that we could become God."  The first great ecumenical council was held in Nicea in 325, and the essence of the Christian faith was distilled into the Articles of Faith, commonly known as "The Nicene Creed."  It's second verse is, "[I believe] in one Lord Jesus Christ, the Son of God, begotten of the Father, Light of Light, very God of very God, begotten, not made, being of one substance with the Father..."   

So the Artcles of Faith, recited in churches around the world daily for 1,700 years profess that Christ was fully God, and fully human.  God became Man, so that man might become God.

I agree with everything else you said.  God does, or does not, exist.  Our belief system does not have any affect on the Truth.  That's why I find it best to let others believe what they want, or not.  My opinions are immaterial.  Anything said in this forum will not change a thing.

Her point was more whether Jesus said it or not rather then people believing it so i think. While there are some passages that can be interpreted as such esp when you get to john, he never directly says "i'm god, deal with it".

[MissBarbara]

Yes, God exists. He told me so this morning.

And there you have it.

Miss Barbara wouldn't lie to me.

Never!

[enchantedpagan012]

Her point was more whether Jesus said it or not rather then people believing it so i think. While there are some passages that can be interpreted as such esp when you get to john, he never directly says "i'm god, deal with it".

Actually, Jesus did claim to be the unique Son of God. As a result, the Jewish leaders tried to kill Him because in "calling God his own Father, [Jesus was] making himself equal with God" (John 5:18 NIV). In John 8:58 Jesus went so far as to use the very words by which God revealed Himself to Moses from the burning bush (Exodus 3:14). To the Jews this was the epitome of blasphemy, for they knew that in doing so Jesus was clearly claiming to be God. On yet another occasion, Jesus explicitly told the Jews: "'I and the Father are one.' Again the Jews picked up stones to stone him, but Jesus said to them, 'I have shown you many great miracles from the Father. For which of these do you stone me?' 'We are not stoning you for any of these,' replied the Jews, 'but for blasphemy, because you, a mere man, claim to be God'" (John 10:30-33).

Furthermore, Jesus made an unmistakable claim to deity before the Chief Priests and the whole Sanhedrin. Caiaphas the High Priest asked him: "'Are you the Christ, the Son of the Blessed One?' 'I am,' said Jesus. 'And you will see the Son of Man sitting at the right hand of the Mighty One and coming on the clouds of heaven'" (Mark 14:61-62 NIV). A biblically illiterate person might well have missed the import of Jesus' words. Caiaphas and the Council, however, did not. They knew that in saying he was "the Son of Man" who would come "on the clouds of heaven" he was making an overt reference to the Son of Man in Daniel's prophecy (Daniel 7:13-14). In doing so, He was not only claiming to be the preexistent Sovereign of the Universe but also prophesying that He would vindicate His claim by judging the very court that was now condemning Him. Moreover, by combining Daniel's prophecy with David's proclamation in Psalm 110, Jesus was claiming that He would sit upon the throne of Israel's God and share God's very glory. To students of the Old Testament this was the height of "blasphemy," thus "they all condemned him as worthy of death" (Mark 14:64-65).

Otherwise, I agree with you completely.

Except in Jewish culture claiming one was god's son was not unusual hence why most biblical scholars do no believe Jesus was killed for blasphemy *among other reasons*. Solomon in chronicles also calls himself the son of god...this was not a unique thing isolated only on Christ. Make no mistake Jesus was killed by Roman authorities because he was a trouble maker. Also the son of man quote is ambiguous....given how he talks in mark one could argue that Jesus was speaking of the messiah to come which according to one set of beliefs would come in the form of a cosmic judge. Jesus is much more humanly. portrayed in this gospel....and much more judgemental. We could pick apart what he said in ad infinitum over here on interpreting things how we want them, but the point stands that Jesus never directly came out and said "hey I'm not really god's son i am god, so deal with it".

[enchantedpagan012]

Book of Toe 5:14 "Hey, I'm not really 'God's son,' I am God.  So deal with it".

  now you are learning.

[Grm]

The Jews are still at it 2000 years later:


A Jewish rabbinical court condemned to death by stoning a stray dog it feared was the reincarnation of a lawyer who insulted its judges, reports say.

The dog entered the Jerusalem financial court several weeks ago and would not leave, reports Israeli website Ynet.

It reminded a judge of a curse passed on a now deceased secular lawyer about 20 years ago, when judges bid his spirit to enter the body of a dog.

The animal is said to have escaped before the sentence was carried out.

One of the judges at the court in the city's ultra-Orthodox Mea Shearim neighbourhood had reportedly asked local children to carry out the sentence.

An animal welfare organisation filed a complaint with the police against a court official, who denied reports that judges had ordered the dog's stoning, according to Ynet.

But a court manager told Israeli daily Yediot Aharonot the stoning had been ordered as "as an appropriate way to 'get back at' the spirit which entered the poor dog", according to Ynet.

Dogs are considered impure animals in traditional Judaism.

[RopeFiend]

I suppose if you can stomach the idea of a Grand Cosmic Muffin, then believing that a dog carries the soul of an evil dead lawyer isn't an unusual stretch of imagination.

<rolls eyes>

[enchantedpagan012]

I suppose if you can stomach the idea of a Grand Cosmic Muffin, then believing that a dog carries the soul of an evil dead lawyer isn't an unusual stretch of imagination.

<rolls eyes>

I love muffins 

[Katiebee]

As soon as you delve into comparative religions in Anthropology two things become very evident.

1. People need to believe in something greater than themselves that produces order in a world full of chaos. (this is the principle of control)

2. If God exists He has been talking to an awful lot of people, and the stupid people have misinterpreted everything He told them.

Point in case, all of our current main religions, and I will restrict this to Christianity, all of our religious laws and precepts were made by men arguing about how THEY interpreted the word of GOD. So you can understand why i'm not overly impressed by most religions.

[enchantedpagan012]

I think Dr. Thomson's report emphasizes that religion played a valuable evolutionary role.  Those groups with a common belief system, and fear of a higher power's displeasure, more easily assimilated, worked together, and sacrificed for a higher cause; however, with the advent of nationalism, loyalty to the state slowly began replacing loyalty to God.

In America, 95% of the populace claim to believe in God.  46% of those polled claim to attend religious services weekly; however an investigative Harris polled revealed the number of weekly attendees is closer to 26%.  Participation decreases dramatically by age group.  65% of those over 65 claim to attend weekly, but only 16% of those in their twenties do.

Dr. Thomson predicts organized religion's demise in the next century.  I give it longer, but it is likely headed that way.  

50 years maybe at best i feel. But then again it depends on what we mean by demise. Just the general retreat of religion from most aspects of life? Or it's complete downfall?