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Does God exist?

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Offline Grm

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Reply #120 on: July 20, 2008, 11:38:16 PM
I know granite is dense but, " I believe in, God! the sun, nature and er global warming and btw I believe in speaking from my ass.



Offline stefanwolf

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Reply #121 on: July 21, 2008, 05:37:52 AM
In this thread, if Im not mistaken, we have already talked about the falacies associated with most people stating there is a god.  I did not anticipate someone equating a forgiving god with nature and then saying that Nature as God is not forgiving. I'm confused I am not even sure if this qualifies a falacy.

I do believe in Nature and that the sun will come over the horizen. I believe in the stars and the universe, But logically that does not relate to any belief in a higher power.  Yes ancient forms of religion believed that the Sun was a god and that the stars were gods, but that was merely an attempt to understand the world and how it worked.

Did a god make the sun nature or me? There is a sun and I am here.  If I say yes then the argument would work as a reason for belief in one.  I do wonder about our misuse of Nature and lament that we didnot use our brains and resources sooner to do something about it.  Sadly tho, the destruction of this planet started thousands of years ago by humans, and perhaps millions years ago by nature.  So are you saying that We as part of nature are god and WE have purposely sealed the fate of ourselves? 

Now I am even more confused, If nature is God and I am part of nature, then am I supposed to or not forgive myself and the rest of nature for the state of the world?

   "If I lick the Henna off the small of a back;   Will it dye my tongue? And if I swallow it down; Will it tattoo my heart?"


Offline Gina Marie

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Reply #122 on: July 21, 2008, 10:42:20 PM
Just for Ya'll to mull over... I have been trying to get Circ to watch this for a little while... perhaps this will help my cause. This sums up many things I felt and thought in school as a young Catholic.


(an excerpt from) Zeitgeist - The Movie



Offline Gina Marie

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Reply #123 on: July 21, 2008, 10:56:02 PM
A few pics as well - cause I felt like laughing about it!







Offline So_Yummy

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Reply #124 on: July 23, 2008, 03:05:13 PM


I really like the fact that Jesus carries a pimp cup.  I hope he keeps that hand strong.



Offline stefanwolf

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Reply #125 on: July 23, 2008, 03:19:16 PM
I will now bow out of the discussion and admit yes there is a God, if not the God of religious texts, then at least the God of humor. I believe the pimp cup is to represent the golden chalice.  Of course if this was taken during MardiGras then the cup was probably full with an alcoholic beverage of some sort.

   "If I lick the Henna off the small of a back;   Will it dye my tongue? And if I swallow it down; Will it tattoo my heart?"


Offline krkjmst

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Reply #126 on: July 31, 2008, 07:43:01 PM
« Last Edit: October 24, 2008, 01:21:07 AM by Gia1978 »



Offline Grm

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Reply #127 on: August 26, 2008, 08:50:12 PM
Here is a metaphysical problem which has puzzled thinkers through the centuries. It is stated this way:

 
   

If God is all powerful and all good then there would be no evil in the world.

 
   

But there is evil in the world.

 
   

Therefore God is not all powerful or all good.

 If the first two premises are true must the conclusion be true? Some answers to this have tried to deny the first premise by appealing to our free will as the source of evil. This however does not account for natural disasters and similar types of evil.

Others have tried to deny the second premise by saying that these calamities are not really evil; they build our character and make us stronger.

Others have accepted the conclusion and often postulate another being, such as a devil, who has power in the universe.

GOD

There are a number of logical arguments given for the existence of God. These arguments rely only on human reasoning; they do not invoke religious faith. They were proposed by philosophers such as Thomas Aquinas (1225-1274) and Saint Anselm (1033-1109) during the Middle Ages in Europe.

The Cosmological Argument:

 
   

If there was an infinite chain of causes of the universe then there would be no universe now.

 
   

But there is a universe now.

 
   

Therefore there must be a first cause of the universe.

 The Argument from Design:

 
   

Most organisms in the world act for a purpose.

 
   

Most organisms are not aware of acting for a purpose.

 
   

There must be a superior being directing their purpose.

 The Ontological Argument:

 
   

The concept of a supreme being is of a being with all perfections.

 
   

Existence is a perfection.

 
   

The supreme being must exist.

 All three of the above arguments have been analyzed and criticized a great deal. They do show how human reasoning tries to grapple with the concept of a supreme being.

 



Offline Grm

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Reply #128 on: October 22, 2008, 10:16:12 AM



The atheist bus campaign launches today thanks to Comment is free readers. Because of your enthusiastic response to the idea of a reassuring God-free advert being used to counter religious advertising, the slogan "There's probably no God. Now stop worrying and enjoy your life" could now become an ad campaign on London buses – and leading secularists have jumped on board to help us raise the money.

The British Humanist Association will be administering all donations to the campaign, and Professor Richard Dawkins, bestselling author of The God Delusion, has generously agreed to match all contributions up to a maximum of £5,500, giving us a total of £11,000 if we raise the full amount. This will be enough to fund two sets of atheist adverts on 30 London buses for four weeks.

If the buses hit the road, this will be the UK's first ever atheist advertising campaign. It's an exciting development, which I never expected when I first proposed the idea on Cif in June. Back then, I was just keen to counter the religious ads running on public transport, which featured a URL to a website telling non-Christians they would spend "all eternity in torment in hell", burning in "a lake of fire". When I suggested the atheist counter-slogan (now shortened for readability), the response was extremely positive, and hundreds of you pledged your support after the follow-up article.

As you read this, a new advertising campaign for Alpha Courses is running on London buses. If you attend an Alpha Course, you will again be told that failing to believe in Jesus will condemn you to hell. There's no doubt that advertising can be effective, and religious advertising works particularly well on those who are vulnerable, frightening them into believing. Religious organisations' jobs are made easier because there's no publicly visible counter-view to refute their threats of eternal damnation.

The atheist bus campaign aims to change this. In addition to the slogan, the adverts will feature the URLs of secular, humanist and atheist websites, so that readers can find out more about atheism as a positive and liberating alternative to religion. We've also set up an interactive campaign website and Facebook group, so that questions raised by the adverts can be publicly debated.

CBS Outdoor, the bus advertising company, will run the atheist adverts in January if the funds are raised – but we need your help to make this happen.

Your donations will give atheism a more visible presence in the UK, generate debate, brighten people's day on the way to work, and hopefully encourage more people to come out as atheists. As Richard Dawkins says: "This campaign to put alternative slogans on London buses will make people think – and thinking is anathema to religion."







Offline kitten

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Reply #129 on: October 23, 2008, 06:32:34 AM
i feel that "it is better to believe in God and find out there is not one than to not believe and find out there is one". Not sure who this quote is by but it is intriguing.



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Reply #130 on: October 23, 2008, 09:31:32 AM
Pascal's faulty logic.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pascals_wager

It's a very childish "wager," in my opinion. It's almost like an excuse to believe in "God."

Pascal's wager gets shit on when you consider the same principals but when applied to any other god that man has invented. What if one of them is the correct god? What if by not believing in one of them you are damning yourself?





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Zotz



Also, when it comes to the christian god, and the christian religion, Pascal makes the assumption that you have nothing to lose by being a christian. I contend that you have much to lose. For starters, you have this website. If you are here, then you are not a real christian. Sorry, fuckers, but you aren't. If you are reveling in sin, then you aren't truly a christian, now are you? You are my heathen brothers and sisters, you just don't consciously realize it yet; you spit in Jesus' face every time you come here, every time you read an erotic story. How could you do that if you really did believe in him? So, I say, "Quit lying to yourself, and embrace a life free of sin." That's right. Do you truly want to live a sin-free life? It's simple, really: QUIT BELIEVING IN SIN!
« Last Edit: October 23, 2008, 10:24:56 AM by Circ »



Offline RopeFiend

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Reply #131 on: October 23, 2008, 04:39:39 PM
I generally apply Occam's Razor and filter out the chaff...

Religion: "First God made heaven & earth.  The earth was without form and void, and darkness was upon the face of the deep; and the Spirit of God was moving over the face of the waters.  And God said, "Let there be light"; and there was light."

Science: "In the beginning, all was darkness.  Then it exploded."

They're both saying the same thing, but the scientific explanation leaves out the superfluous "imaginary friend" parts.  I can live with that.  :D

Remember the Golden Rule: you do me, and I\'ll do you (paraphrased)


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Reply #132 on: October 23, 2008, 10:21:17 PM
And that is why a person's religious views should be private and not forced down another's throat, but at the same time his or her views should not be held up to scorn or ridicule.

Emancipate yourself from mental slavery, none but ourselves can free our minds.


Offline RopeFiend

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Reply #133 on: October 24, 2008, 12:55:28 AM
And that is why a person's religious views should be private and not forced down another's throat, but at the same time his or her views should not be held up to scorn or ridicule.

And in the Land of 1408, a voice from above was heard, saying thus:

Unlike the rest of the forum, Room 1408 has no rules on flaming, insulting other members or bad language. If you don't like being insulted, sworn at and generally have your parentage and intelligence called into question, then this isn't the right section for you.

And Gawd saw the flames, and saw that it was good.  Ahhhhhh, men.  ;D

Remember the Golden Rule: you do me, and I\'ll do you (paraphrased)


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Reply #134 on: October 24, 2008, 01:29:59 AM
Pascal's faulty logic.

Pascal's wager gets shit on when you consider the same principals but when applied to any other god that man has invented. What if one of them is the correct god? What if by not believing in one of them you are damning yourself?

Abassi....

...Zotz



Your list of names reminded me of this short story, that I read when I was in high school.





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Reply #135 on: October 24, 2008, 02:19:14 AM
Reminds me of Pi.


Also kind of reminds me of The Unpleasant Profession of Jonathan Hoag by Heinlein.[/color]



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Reply #136 on: October 24, 2008, 03:51:56 AM



he says may go strike me dead.....uhhh..is dead......i think there is a god, but that no one human can understand the totality of God so there are all of the other god s and goddesses, each being a different face of the same Being

SEX KITTENS OF THE WORLD UNITE!


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Reply #137 on: October 24, 2008, 04:13:06 AM



Offline watcher1

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Reply #138 on: October 24, 2008, 07:37:53 PM
Hey RopeFiend,

I respect a person's priviledge to call himself or herself an atheist, a believer, agnostic, or whatever, and I understand the so-called law of 1408, but with so many other things in the world that can be ridiculed, satired, made fun of, or just plain debased, I just think a person's religious belief is a very personal thing. Come back to me when you have experienced sitting in a bug infested jungle, eighteen years old, and seeing your best friend dying with a sucking chest wound, crying for his mother and praying the rosary. Talk is cheap when you live in the land of plenty.

Emancipate yourself from mental slavery, none but ourselves can free our minds.


Circ

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Reply #139 on: October 24, 2008, 08:12:31 PM
If you come here with no position at all other than your feelings are getting hurt by people shitting on your religion, you are going to get shit on as well. Instead of being a little bitch about it, you can take a position and defend it. And then, maybe someone will give a fuck about what you have to say.