Ray Rice

[wolfs_grace]

I guess the Rice case was just what "outted" a dark side of the NFL. Or does this trickle down to other big Names in Big Games? Least we forget Boxing and its heavy players.

Just thinking the management has missed the whole point. 

[joan1984]

  The issue of Domestic Violence has a life of it's own, independent and apart from Sports, amateur and professional, major league or minor league, whether Baseball, Football, Soccer, Boxing, likely to Tennis and all over society. It has little to do with Sports, except that known personalities develop from Sports accomplishments, and we notice their transgressions because of who they are, and their role in our (fantasy, gambling, leisure) lives.

  The issue crosses all lines, gender, gender preference, white, black, brown and whatever, and is well hidden from public exposure, just not a "story" in most cases, because it is so prevalent. The Courts are filled with cases, and Prosecutors offices are inundated, to the point where there are expedited systems to process those accused, and get them off the dockets.

A New Jersey prosecutor, speaking "not about the Ray Rice case" specifically, but in general, said its not like choices for the Prosecutor were "5 years" or "Diversion Program". The truth is that the most severe charge that could have been brought, Assault in the Third Degree, carries a recommended the maximum sentence of Probation, w/charges brought, and the case Won by the Prosecution.

Why is this? I do not know the history or details, but I do know it has little to do with the employers of these persons, and everything to do with their life experiences growing up, what they learned, witnessed, and what is acceptable culturally among their peers and acquaintances.

We get to see, today, all the warts on players and those in this spotlight, and with the election coming it fits the agenda of the left to continue hyping this as if there is something we as individuals can do to prevent this, or penalize all involved. Big money complicates and makes the stories that much more 'juicy' for broadcast chatter and ratings. Sudden life is blown into the usual suspects who are desperate to get on the air with one view or another.

This is a people problem. Without a dead body, prosecution and guilty verdicts result in the person remaining among us, only shamed to the extent his/her community feels strongly about the transgressions. This is not a workplace crime in the overwhelming number of cases. Lack of the ability to work creates more pressure on the victims, who will report the behavior even less, knowing their ability to pay their bills and live their lives will be hampered.

Is the behavior despicable? Yes. Can WE demand the employer take some action, as WE are their feeders, WE buy from their advertisers, WE buy game tickets, WE can make their lives hell and divert air time as WE have the past few weeks, or as the Press has "in our name"? Of course we can. Should we?

In my opinion, no. This is a matter for civil authorities to resolve, and OUR focus should be on hiring, OUR voting for and OUR demanding sufficient law and attention in OUR communities for such activities. OUR taxes pay the costs of such activities, OUR Police deal with this action daily, OUR Jails and Prisons will be filled with the perpetrators if OUR elected officials throw the books at them.

Crucifixion of executives of Sports leagues will not resolve this issue.

I guess the Rice case was just what "outted" a dark side of the NFL. Or does this trickle down to other big Names in Big Games? Least we forget Boxing and its heavy players.

Just thinking the management has missed the whole point. 

[Athos_131]

Are you saying it's never appropriate to pressure a business for unethical practices?

[watcher1]

Ray Rice is appealing his suspension.  Meanwhile, Goodell has appointed three women, one a prominent NYC attorney in these types of matters, to look into this problem. Let's hope some good comes from this Rice event and others in that the NFL establishes some strict guidelines against brutalizing women.

[Athos_131]

Ray Rice is appealing his suspension.  Meanwhile, Goodell has appointed three women, one a prominent NYC attorney in these types of matters, to look into this problem. Let's hope some good comes from this Rice event and others in that the NFL establishes some strict guidelines against brutalizing women.

[joan1984]

I am saying organized public shaming/boycott is not the appropriate action, or place to fix this problem. The problem is the perpetrators, and the criminal and civil courts who are not addressing domestic violence seriously with jail time. Of course, jail time would simply increase the cost of the perp being caged to the taxpayer, but may just get his attention, and force a behavioral change.

This employer gave a punishment to the Team, effectively, of a two game suspension, during which they could not use their 'under contract' asset, Mr. Rice, in the game planning and on the field, with no redress offered to the employer for loss of the use of this asset.
The employer, The Baltimore Ravens, should treat this infringement on their agreement the way they would treat any errant behavior, and some sort of discipline by the team would be among their options.
They chose to deal with the situation, and did not make public any personnel actions taken against Mr. Rice, which is normal behavior.

The player agreed to a fine of $500,000 dollars (one half million dollars) for his transgression and it's affect on the NFL Brand, as well as the inability to play for 2 games, which cost him his game check, and perhaps affected bonus money dependent on specific performance and stats he may have earned during those two games.

The State did not press charges, in return for Mr. Rice attending some classes, the usual "intervention" action given to a offender with his NJ record, if any, for similar infractions. His victim and fiance married him which kind of made her his wife, and i suppose unable to testify against him or whatever, but basically did not leave the S.O.B. given the chance. Let us hope she has a father, brother or someone who knows such people, to beat him to a pulp when the season ends, on her behalf, the old fashioned way to handle such issues in New Jersey.

Ray Rice is the perpetrator, and is the person who needs to fix his ways, not the Baltimore Ravens, not the NFL. In my opinion, if he served jail time for felony assault, he would not be available to satisfy his work contract, and the Ravens would have fired him, and hired a replacement when they could. His actions in no way benefited the NFL or the Baltimore Ravens.

When a plumber is a perpetrator, or a doctor, or a dentist, or a baker, or a candlestick maker, their employers are not boycotted, or brought up on charges, or liable in any manner for what the asshole they hired did to his partner. The same rule of law applies here.

Period, as BHO may say.

 

Are you saying it's never appropriate to pressure a business for unethical practices?

[Athos_131]

Just an FYI, since you don't understand how most standard NFL contracts work.  They can be voided at anytime.  If I recall the Ravens had to eat a $12 million signing bonus.  If they had waited it's possible they could have recouped that money, like the Patriots did in the Aaron Hernandez murder case.

Professional sport is a business.  If Wal-Mart supported domestic abuse by its employees and helped to cover it up, they should face the same scrutiny.

[joan1984]

When did the NFL or the Baltimore Ravens "support" domestic abuse by anyone? Or WalMart for that matter? That is a unsupported claim, methinks.

An employer/employee relationship naturally is at the will of the employer. A contract relationship is just what it says. The agreed penalty imposed by the NFL, accepted by the Player and the team involved nothing about a signing bonus.

The panic decision to impose a greater penalty, for no apparent reason other than a video being televised, and worry about perceptions, and Democrat left wing activists nagging, and the Press, but I am being redundant employing their usual over the top publicity tactics, caused the Team and the Player to react predictably.

Double jeopardy is what this is called, is unfair, and the NFL is wrong in my opinion. Fairness is what our legal system is all about. We await the results of his appeal with interest.

This does not make Mr. Rice "correct" in any manner of his actions.

Just an FYI, since you don't understand how most standard NFL contracts work.  They can be voided at anytime.  If I recall the Ravens had to eat a $12 million signing bonus.  If they had waited it's possible they could have recouped that money.

Professional sport is a business.  If Wal-Mart supported domestic abuse by its employees and helped to cover it up, they should face the same scrutiny.

[Athos_131]

All NFL contracts have a personal conduct clause in them.  It was collectively bargained.  It's his problem he ran afoul of the law.

Furthermore,

https://twitter.com/johnrabe/status/509046789757222912

@johnrabe

The #Ravens didn't release Ray Rice when they saw this video. They released Ray Rice when YOU saw this video. Remember that. #RayRIce #NFL

[joan1984]

They released him when the NFL imposed an additional penalty, which is my point. The Ravens will act in their own interest, and facing the reality of the NFL action, the right action was to release him for the Ravens purposes.

Anyone who saw the vid of him dragging her body out of the elevator knew what happened inside the elevator. Why does the public seeing the video change any facts. The NJ Prosecutor had the videos and did not take any action beyond the non criminal agreement to attend classes.

The NFL action taken at first was viewed as too lenient, likely because little emphasis was made about the Half Million dollar fine, in my opinion, just the Two Game suspension, and whatever game check value that had for Mr. Rice.

My thinking is the NFL should do a monetary fine, leave suspensions up to the Team, as it is the team that suffers loss of it's asset, the player, and the Team is more under pressure from ticket holders and its fans as far as who they hire, who they play or don't play.

Same goes for NBA and Hockey and Boxing, and other employers. Up the fine, and allow the teams to make decisions about personnel.

All NFL contracts have a personal conduct clause in them.  It was collectively bargained.  It's his problem he ran afoul of the law.

Furthermore,

https://twitter.com/johnrabe/status/509046789757222912

@johnrabe

The #Ravens didn't release Ray Rice when they saw this video. They released Ray Rice when YOU saw this video. Remember that. #RayRIce #NFL

[Athos_131]

http://www.kristensboard.com/forums/index.php?topic=21823.msg318841#msg318841

[Athos_131]

https://www.documentcloud.org/documents/1102477-nfl-personal-conduct-policy.html

[Athos_131]

More Cities Using Text-Based Alert System To Warn Americans If They Are In Range Of NFL Players

[joan1984]

More Cities Using Text-Based Alert System To Warn Americans If They Are In Range Of NFL Players

Ray Rice indicative of violence in the NFL? Data says no
By Jim Picht, Communities Digital News

WASHINGTON, September 13, 2014 — The National Organization for Women (NOW) called for the resignation of NFL Commissioner Roger Goodell this week. They said that the NFL “has a violence against women problem.”

NOW President Terry O’Neill said in a statement that “the NFL has lost its way. It doesn’t have a Ray Rice problem, it has a violence against women problem.”

Does it?

The data say no, it does not. More than that, the data say that NFL players are half as likely to commit domestic violence as men in their 20s in the general population.

A 15-year-old academic study by Alfred Blumstein and Jeff Benedict was one of the first to look at this issue. In a paper titled “Criminal Violence of NFL Players Compared to the General Population,” they compared arrest data for NFL players and other men for a variety of crimes, including assault (non-domestic), domestic violence, rape, kidnapping, homicide, DUI, drugs, and property offenses.

Blumstein and Benedict found that of the 342 black players in their sample, 97 of them, or 28 percent, had an arrest for one of these crimes. There were 77 whites in the sample; seven of them, or 9 percent, had an arrest

Those numbers appear high until we compare them with arrest numbers for the general population. The FBI’s Uniform Crime Reports provided the arrest data. For the general population, the arrest rate for assault for black men was 6,990 per 100,00, and for whites, 2,209.

The corresponding rate for NFL players, black and white, was less than half the rate for the general population.

More recently, USA Today published its USA Today NFL Arrests Database, which goes from 2000, just after the Blumstein-Benedict study, to today. Benjamin Morris at FiveThirtyEight’s DataLab used these data with the Bureau of Crime Statistics’ Arrest Data Analysis Tool to compare arrest rates for NFL players and the general population.

Morris looked only at the 25-30 age group, which most closely reflects the age of NFL players. What he found was that, again, NFL players have arrest rates far below the general population. Their arrest rates for domestic violence are half the rate of the general public, just as Blumstein and Benedict found. In addition, Morris found that NFL arrest rates for DUI were about one-fourth the general rate; for non-domestic assault, about one-sixth; for sex offenses, about one-half; and for non-violent gun-related offenses, about one-half.

Overall, arrest rates in the NFL are only 13 percent those for the general public among men aged 25 to 30.

There are a variety of reasons for this, the most obvious being that the average income of NFL players is high, with higher arrest rates strongly correlated with lower income. It isn’t possible with the existing data to sort domestic violence arrests by income level, but the fact remains: Terry O’Neill and others who claim the NFL has an unusual problem of violence against women are very wrong.

An alternative reading would be that they’re correct, but that teachers, plumbers, firefighters, construction workers and college professors combined have an even bigger problem of violence against women.

Another conclusion comes from the fact that about 40 percent of reported domestic violence victims are men. Researchers note that heterosexual males are much less likely to report abuse by a spouse or cohabiter to the police. Feminists reject the notion of “gender symmetry” in domestic violence, but studies have found that in domestic violence cases, men strike the first blow 27 percent of the time, women 24 percent, and the violence is a mutual brawl the remainder of the time.

If we accept these data, we are forced to conclude that women are more violent in domestic relationships than NFL players.

The video recording of Ryan Rice striking his fiancée is disturbing, and a matter for police investigation (Rice was required to receive anger-management training). But the hysteria over NFL violence is just that.

What we’re facing is not an epidemic of man-against-woman violence in the NFL, but of ideologically driven NFL bashing.

The current furor over NFL violence is reminiscent of another episode: In 1993, at a Pasadena news conference before that year’s Super Bowl game, reporters were told by women’s groups that Super Sunday was the biggest day of the year for domestic violence.

They reported that the violence rate increased by 40 percent on Super Sunday.

That “fact” was widely reported and repeated for years. It prompted public service ads to encourage men to stay calm during the game, and women to call for help before things got bad. It was obviously true; it matched what feminists believe about men and what people believe about the louts who watch football.

It was a misandrist slur. Domestic violence rates don’t rise during the Super Bowl.

As a side note, we might wonder whether, like Rice, all domestic abusers, male and female, should not only be punished by the law, but by their employers and forced into unemployment. The NFL is concerned with protecting its image and has every right to fire Rice to do it, and even Goodell.

However, calls from outside the NFL to require that the NFL fire abusers would seem peculiar if aimed at journalists and professors.

Employers can fire you for any reason they please, as long as it isn’t your gender, your race, your age, or your membership in any other protected class. They can certainly fire you for domestic abuse. But just how badly and how long do we think we should punish abusers, drug users, flashers and public urinators? The growing consensus seems to be, “as much as we can, and forever.”

This further points to the likelihood that what we are observing is witch-hunting hysteria, not reasoned, data-driven policy.

Ray Rice is clearly the sort of man I wouldn’t want dating my daughter, but he should thank his lucky stars that we no longer hang or burn witches.


Read more at http://www.commdiginews.com/news-2/ray-rice-domestic-violence-and-the-nfl-a-phony-problem-25857/#JZJy52ACADQoojp4.99

[Athos_131]

More Cities Using Text-Based Alert System To Warn Americans If They Are In Range Of NFL Players

Ray Rice indicative of violence in the NFL? Data says no
By Jim Picht, Communities Digital News

WASHINGTON, September 13, 2014 — The National Organization for Women (NOW) called for the resignation of NFL Commissioner Roger Goodell this week. They said that the NFL “has a violence against women problem.”

NOW President Terry O’Neill said in a statement that “the NFL has lost its way. It doesn’t have a Ray Rice problem, it has a violence against women problem.”

Does it?

The data say no, it does not. More than that, the data say that NFL players are half as likely to commit domestic violence as men in their 20s in the general population.

A 15-year-old academic study by Alfred Blumstein and Jeff Benedict was one of the first to look at this issue. In a paper titled “Criminal Violence of NFL Players Compared to the General Population,” they compared arrest data for NFL players and other men for a variety of crimes, including assault (non-domestic), domestic violence, rape, kidnapping, homicide, DUI, drugs, and property offenses.

Blumstein and Benedict found that of the 342 black players in their sample, 97 of them, or 28 percent, had an arrest for one of these crimes. There were 77 whites in the sample; seven of them, or 9 percent, had an arrest

Those numbers appear high until we compare them with arrest numbers for the general population. The FBI’s Uniform Crime Reports provided the arrest data. For the general population, the arrest rate for assault for black men was 6,990 per 100,00, and for whites, 2,209.

The corresponding rate for NFL players, black and white, was less than half the rate for the general population.

More recently, USA Today published its USA Today NFL Arrests Database, which goes from 2000, just after the Blumstein-Benedict study, to today. Benjamin Morris at FiveThirtyEight’s DataLab used these data with the Bureau of Crime Statistics’ Arrest Data Analysis Tool to compare arrest rates for NFL players and the general population.

Morris looked only at the 25-30 age group, which most closely reflects the age of NFL players. What he found was that, again, NFL players have arrest rates far below the general population. Their arrest rates for domestic violence are half the rate of the general public, just as Blumstein and Benedict found. In addition, Morris found that NFL arrest rates for DUI were about one-fourth the general rate; for non-domestic assault, about one-sixth; for sex offenses, about one-half; and for non-violent gun-related offenses, about one-half.

Overall, arrest rates in the NFL are only 13 percent those for the general public among men aged 25 to 30.

There are a variety of reasons for this, the most obvious being that the average income of NFL players is high, with higher arrest rates strongly correlated with lower income. It isn’t possible with the existing data to sort domestic violence arrests by income level, but the fact remains: Terry O’Neill and others who claim the NFL has an unusual problem of violence against women are very wrong.

An alternative reading would be that they’re correct, but that teachers, plumbers, firefighters, construction workers and college professors combined have an even bigger problem of violence against women.

Another conclusion comes from the fact that about 40 percent of reported domestic violence victims are men. Researchers note that heterosexual males are much less likely to report abuse by a spouse or cohabiter to the police. Feminists reject the notion of “gender symmetry” in domestic violence, but studies have found that in domestic violence cases, men strike the first blow 27 percent of the time, women 24 percent, and the violence is a mutual brawl the remainder of the time.

If we accept these data, we are forced to conclude that women are more violent in domestic relationships than NFL players.

The video recording of Ryan Rice striking his fiancée is disturbing, and a matter for police investigation (Rice was required to receive anger-management training). But the hysteria over NFL violence is just that.

What we’re facing is not an epidemic of man-against-woman violence in the NFL, but of ideologically driven NFL bashing.

The current furor over NFL violence is reminiscent of another episode: In 1993, at a Pasadena news conference before that year’s Super Bowl game, reporters were told by women’s groups that Super Sunday was the biggest day of the year for domestic violence.

They reported that the violence rate increased by 40 percent on Super Sunday.

That “fact” was widely reported and repeated for years. It prompted public service ads to encourage men to stay calm during the game, and women to call for help before things got bad. It was obviously true; it matched what feminists believe about men and what people believe about the louts who watch football.

It was a misandrist slur. Domestic violence rates don’t rise during the Super Bowl.

As a side note, we might wonder whether, like Rice, all domestic abusers, male and female, should not only be punished by the law, but by their employers and forced into unemployment. The NFL is concerned with protecting its image and has every right to fire Rice to do it, and even Goodell.

However, calls from outside the NFL to require that the NFL fire abusers would seem peculiar if aimed at journalists and professors.

Employers can fire you for any reason they please, as long as it isn’t your gender, your race, your age, or your membership in any other protected class. They can certainly fire you for domestic abuse. But just how badly and how long do we think we should punish abusers, drug users, flashers and public urinators? The growing consensus seems to be, “as much as we can, and forever.”

This further points to the likelihood that what we are observing is witch-hunting hysteria, not reasoned, data-driven policy.

Ray Rice is clearly the sort of man I wouldn’t want dating my daughter, but he should thank his lucky stars that we no longer hang or burn witches.


Read more at http://www.commdiginews.com/news-2/ray-rice-domestic-violence-and-the-nfl-a-phony-problem-25857/#JZJy52ACADQoojp4.99

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Onion

The Onion is an American digital media company and news satire organization. It runs an entertainment website featuring satirical articles reporting on international, national, and local news.

[Athos_131]

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