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Obamacare is sooooooo wonderful...

m4mpetcock · 2306

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Offline m4mpetcock

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on: July 01, 2013, 12:16:46 AM
...that Democrats can't run from it fast enough.


Congress plots exit from Obamacare coverage

http://www.miamiherald.com/2013/06/17/3456447/glenn-garvin-congress-plots-exit.html



Congress is not as stupid as you think.

I realize that is not a high bar; but still, credit must be given when credit is due. Quite often when our duly-elected political representatives get together in Washington to pass some ill-designed, over-intrusive and brutally expensive law, they recognize the difficulties it will create — and so they exempt themselves.

The Occupational Safety and Health Administration?

The National Labor Relations Act?

Minimum wage laws?

None of them govern Congress.

The much-lauded Sarbanes-Oxley Act, which sends corporate executives to prison for falsifying financial data, would decimate Congress if it were applied to the federal budgeting process. Which is exactly why it doesn’t.

Once in a while, even Congress gets embarrassed by the legal loopholes it writes itself.

When 60 Minutes reported a couple of years ago that it wasn’t illegal for members of Congress or their staffs to engage in insider stock trading, they scurried to outlaw the practice. For a year, anyway. In April, Congress quietly gutted the public-disclosure measures that were at the heart of the new law.

So it should come as no surprise that, as implementation of major provisions of the Obamacare law approaches, Congress is stealthily plotting its exit.

The website Politico revealed last week that talks are underway on Capitol Hill to toss out part of the law that would strip Congress and its staffers of their sweetheart healthcare package.

Lawmakers and their aides — like many federal workers — have been covered for years by the lucrative (for them; not so much for us) Federal Employee Health Benefits Program, which pays 75 percent and up of the premiums.

But when the Obamacare law was being debated, Sen. Chuck Grassley, R-Iowa, a long-time opponent of the legal loopholes lawmakers write for themselves, argued that if Obamacare was so great, Congress and its staff should be subject to the thing.

When Grassley’s criticism started to win popular support, Democrats quickly moved to shut him up by approving his amendment that required Congress and its staffers to enter the new government healthcare exchanges created by the law. They even bragged about how they had called Grassley’s bluff.

Now that the moment for joining the exchanges is at hand, though, members of Congress have discovered that the murky law they passed may prohibit the heavy federal subsidies required to support the benefits they’ve granted themselves all these years.

Buying insurance on those new exchanges, like (gasp!) regular people, will be expensive.

That’s especially true for congressional staffers, who tend to be young people — the major victims of Obamacare.

Young adults, who are healthier and use healthcare less, have always been cheaper to insure than older people. But their rates are going to skyrocket, 75 percent or more, under Obamacare, which will charge them more to subsidize the insurance of older people.

That’s OK for the rest of us. But it won’t do for Congress and its minions, who are now in search of relief from the mess they’ve created for themselves.

The preferred solution is what Congress calls “administrative” — that is, getting some captive government agency to rule that the law doesn’t really say what it says. That way, Congress doesn’t have to take the political heat.

The preferred candidate in this case is the Office of Personnel Management, which administers federal employee benefits. Lawmakers hope the office will declare that Congress has the legal authority to continue subsidizing its own insurance even when purchased through the exchanges.

But if that doesn’t work out, the pols will try to remove the Grassley amendment or even go to court to extract themselves from the clutches of Obamacare.

“I think we should begin an immediate amicus brief to say, ‘Listen this is simply not fair to these employees,’ ” said Rep. John Larson, a Connecticut Democrat who helped steer Obamacare through Congress. “They are federal employees.”

As he is. And as we are not.

(End of article)


Like Leona Helmsley's "Taxes are only for the little people", Democrats feel the same way about Obamacare. 






I can resist anything but temptation.  - Oscar Wilde


Offline Gina Marie

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Offline m4mpetcock

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Reply #2 on: July 01, 2013, 12:58:08 AM
Beautiful non-answer.


What better way to show you have none? 

I can resist anything but temptation.  - Oscar Wilde


Offline m4mpetcock

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Reply #3 on: July 01, 2013, 01:02:01 AM
And it's soooo damned wonderful, the administration has to try to recruit the NBA, the NFL, and who know who else, besides the California school kids they're indoctrinating to sell it to their parents.


It's too bad the NFL said "No".  This would have made a great ad:



« Last Edit: July 01, 2013, 01:07:24 AM by m4mpetcock »

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Offline Gina Marie

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Reply #4 on: July 01, 2013, 01:13:24 AM
Beautiful non-answer.
What better way to show you have none? 

Oh I'm sorry... you were hungry? - did you need some troll-treats? yeahnotsomuch.



Offline Katiebee

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Reply #5 on: July 01, 2013, 04:14:23 AM
Actually, all parties have participated in the largess. The House and senate are the only bodies that can exempt themselves from laws and regulations, vote their own compensation and give themselves extra benefits. The only other bodies that close to that kind of abilities are boards of directors.

With un-regulated power comes corruption.

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Offline m4mpetcock

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Reply #6 on: July 01, 2013, 01:48:48 PM
Actually, all parties have participated in the largess. The House and senate are the only bodies that can exempt themselves from laws and regulations, vote their own compensation and give themselves extra benefits. The only other bodies that close to that kind of abilities are boards of directors.

With un-regulated power comes corruption.


But the question remains:  If highly-paid Congressional staffers can't afford the so-called "Affordable Care Act", then the Affordable Care Act isn't so affordable, is it?

I can resist anything but temptation.  - Oscar Wilde


Offline m4mpetcock

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Reply #7 on: July 01, 2013, 01:52:50 PM
Beautiful non-answer.
What better way to show you have none? 

Oh I'm sorry... you were hungry? - did you need some troll-treats? yeahnotsomuch.




I can resist anything but temptation.  - Oscar Wilde


Offline Katiebee

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Reply #8 on: July 01, 2013, 02:03:38 PM
It's not that they can't afford it, it's that they want the nearly free medical care that they have been enjoying.

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Offline Katiebee

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Reply #9 on: July 01, 2013, 02:04:56 PM
Oh there is a twist there. Staffers are not as highly paid in general as you would think. Only the top staffed are paid well.

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Offline Lois

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Reply #10 on: July 01, 2013, 06:36:28 PM
I'm actually feeling much better about the Affordable Care Act.  My initial concerned was that I would not be able to afford the required coverage, but now I understand that it will be subsidized via a tax credit.  Whew!

Still not happy about insurance companies being involved in the process though.



Offline m4mpetcock

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Reply #11 on: July 01, 2013, 07:15:50 PM
It's not that they can't afford it, it's that they want the nearly free medical care that they have been enjoying.


Ah, but that's not the way they're framing their argument. 



“I think we should begin an immediate amicus brief to say, ‘Listen this is simply not fair to these employees,’ ” said Rep. John Larson, a Connecticut Democrat who helped steer Obamacare through Congress. “They are federal employees.”


They're making it appear that it's unfair because their employees can't afford it.  So, they're not being entirely truthful? 

And if it's unfair to federal employees, how can it be fair to Joe Public?  (Tax credit or not, ie: from Lois' post.)

I can resist anything but temptation.  - Oscar Wilde


Offline Katiebee

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Reply #12 on: July 01, 2013, 08:02:44 PM
Because the members of Congess don't want to pay their employees an adequate wage.

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Offline m4mpetcock

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Reply #13 on: July 01, 2013, 08:13:25 PM
Because the members of Congess don't want to pay their employees an adequate wage.


Are you stating that as a fact (which can be backed up)?  Or speculation?

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Offline RopeFiend

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Reply #14 on: July 01, 2013, 09:07:29 PM

Some of the companies out here are simply tossing in the towel.  It's cheaper to pay the fine (per person) for NOT supporting Obamacare than it is to implement it.  That ought to be called an "oopsie".

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Offline m4mpetcock

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Reply #15 on: July 01, 2013, 09:44:37 PM

Some of the companies out here are simply tossing in the towel.  It's cheaper to pay the fine (per person) for NOT supporting Obamacare than it is to implement it.  That ought to be called an "oopsie".

And then there's the "challenge" of putting their money where their mouth is.


http://townhall.com/columnists/jonahgoldberg/2013/06/21/a-challenge-to-young-obama-supporters-n1623819/page/full


A Challenge to Young Obama Supporters

Jonah Goldberg | Jun 21, 2013



OK, young'ns, here's your chance.

In two consecutive elections, you've carried Barack Obama to victory. When he said, "We are the ones we've been waiting for," he basically meant you. You voted for Obama by a margin of 66 percent to 32 percent in 2008, and, despite a horrendous economy for people your age, by nearly that much again in 2012.

The president announced his candidacy in 2007 by insisting, "This campaign can't only be about me. It must be about us -- it must be about what we can do together. This campaign must be the occasion, the vehicle, of your hopes, and your dreams. ... This campaign has to be about reclaiming the meaning of citizenship, restoring our sense of common purpose, and realizing that few obstacles can withstand the power of millions of voices calling for change."

And on the night of his re-election in 2012, he proclaimed: "The role of citizens in our democracy does not end with your vote. America's never been about what can be done for us. It's about what can be done by us, together, through the hard and frustrating but necessary work of self-government. That's the principle we were founded on."

Between those two elections, the president pandered to you like no president in American history. As I wrote last fall, he visited college campuses more often than a Red Bull delivery truck. He's carried water for you on college loans like an aqueduct. He made sure you can stay on your parents' health-care plans until you're 26, which is a really nice consolation prize when you can't find a job.

And not to put too fine a point on it, but you kids ate that stuff up. It reminded me of H.L. Mencken's line about Harry Truman: "If there had been any formidable body of cannibals in the country he would have promised to provide them with free missionaries, fattened at the taxpayers' expense."

Whenever curmudgeons like yours truly suggested that young people were getting caught up in a fad or that Obama was simply buying votes at the expense of taxpayers, you'd have a fit. You'd insist that millennials are not only informed, but eager to make sacrifices for the greater good.

Well, here's your chance to prove it: Fork over whatever it costs to buy the best health insurance you can under Obamacare. Just in case you forgot, under Obamacare, healthy young people such as yourself not only need to buy health insurance in order for the whole thing to work, but you have to be overcharged for it. If you don't pay more -- probably a lot more -- than what you could get today on the market in most states, Obamacare will come apart like wet toilet paper.

Estimates vary and depend on how much you make and where you live, but if you're buying health care yourself, your out-of-pocket costs will probably be at least a couple hundred bucks a month, give or take. The Kaiser Family Foundation's "subsidy calculator" estimates that a 26-year-old nonsmoker making $30,000 a year will pay $2,512 a year for the "silver plan." Although, if you fill out all of the paperwork, the feds could send you a check for about $500. If you smoke, the premium rises to over $4,000. (The subsidy stays the same.) Also, the more you make, the more your insurance will cost because the subsidies will get smaller.

Of course, the above is a pretty rosy scenario. The more young people who don't sign up, the higher the premiums will have to be to cover the costs of those who do. Many experts think the sky's the limit to how high prices will go.

And as prices go up, the whole thing might go down. Actuaries call this the "death spiral." The old and sick race to sign up, but the young and healthy opt to stay out. That causes prices to go up, and more people to drop out. And since the fine for not signing up is so much lower than premiums, lots of people will just wait until they're sick before buying insurance.

Now, that might be the smart play -- for cynics.

But you're not cynical. You didn't vote for Obama and cheer the passage of Obamacare because it was the cool thing to do. You did your homework. You want to share the sacrifice. You want to secure the president's legacy.

And now's your chance to prove it.

I can resist anything but temptation.  - Oscar Wilde


Offline Gina Marie

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Reply #16 on: July 01, 2013, 10:55:27 PM
YAY! A new Breitbart/Blaze/RedState! b'cause 'Merruhkkkuh!

http://townhall.com



Offline m4mpetcock

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Reply #17 on: July 01, 2013, 11:14:53 PM

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Offline Katiebee

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Reply #18 on: July 02, 2013, 12:10:16 AM
It's been a hectic day for me.

The number if staffers vary by stat and representative.

This article speaks about the top paid house staffers, 2000 in total.

http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0310/35050_Page2.html

There are approximately 12,000 staffers and that information is old.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Congressional_staff

A look at the budgeting that is fairly current is here http://ballotpedia.org/wiki/index.php/Staff_salaries_of_United_States_Senators_and_Representatives#Highest.2FLowest_Paid_Senatorial_Staff_Members

The highest paid make 6 figures, the median would be, I suppose around $60k.

The majority of the staffers are not paid competitive wages for te area an what they are asked to do, but it is likely that they are paid comparable wages to each other.

The following link gives an average by job title.

http://www.theopenhouseproject.com/2009/12/02/whats-the-average-salary-of-house-staff/

So which staffers are they referring to?
« Last Edit: July 02, 2013, 12:14:35 AM by Katiebee »

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Offline Lostforkate

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Reply #19 on: July 02, 2013, 12:26:46 PM
my over simplistic solution to health care

simply expand VA hospitals and funding.

1) let lower income people use them like a veterans. The added funding would also improve the care for our veterans, as well as adding locations.

2) break up some of the monopolies on insurance as many do not really have a choice. For instance, my company lets us choose plan a or plan b. They are both offered by the same company, but by different names. 20 years ago, my company offered real choices, and the insurance companies competed for my choice. The competition made it so they had woo me.