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Offline Lois

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on: December 29, 2012, 06:21:46 PM
I believe that the only thing which will bring the republican party to its senses is a defeat so catastrophic that it gives democrats complete control of the country for a while -- just like what happened after Bush left office. It's possible nothing is going to change until the mid-term elections when the people have the opportunity once again to remove those who will not follow the will of the electorate.

There people have, quite simply, forgotten who they work for.


The American Debate: All reason leaves the GOP

All sanity seems to have left the ranks of those in charge of the GOP. Increasingly, it is becoming clear that the party is against everything and for nothing. That's not governing. That's just lobbing hand grenades. And the GOP is shrinking daily before our eyes.

But those aren't my words. That stinging assessment comes courtesy of Mark McKinnon, a Texas-based Republican consultant and adviser to George W. Bush.

At this point in the fiscal-cliff crisis, with House Republican ideologues seemingly so willing to plunge America over the precipice, there is indeed no need for me to state the obvious. I can just quote the sane Republicans, as they assail their unhinged brethren. For instance, here's Congressman Steven LaTourette of Ohio, lamenting the tax-phobic conservatives who refuse to face fiscal reality:

"It weakens the entire Republican party.... It's the continuing dumbing-down of the Republican party, and we are going to be seen more and more as a bunch of extremists."

And as a result, we now have a crisis of governance.

There's no sane reason why President Obama and Congress can't compromise on a year-end budget deal that raises taxes on top-bracket Americans (while preserving the Bush-era middle-class cuts), and slices into federal spending. Obama has already offered those terms - a tax hike on people earning $400,000 or more (his original proposal was $250,000), plus an array of spending cuts deep enough to tick off the Democratic left. But the House GOP rank and file said no.

House Speaker John Boehner tried to woo his rank and file with "Plan B," proposing a tax hike on millionaires. But again his recalcitrant troops said no. Most Americans believe that a high-end tax hike is essential to any compromise - every poll says so - and Obama won reelection after campaigning on that premise. In fact, the Gallup poll released Wednesday reports that 54 percent of Americans endorse Obama's handling of the fiscal-cliff crisis. The congressional GOP's approval rating is 26 percent.

But House conservatives don't care. They're adamant that the rich should never be compelled to dip into their pockets for the betterment of all.

McKinnon, in his post the other day, ruefully wrote: "It's a very odd situation when the losing party is the party refusing to negotiate. It may be how you disrupt, but it is not how you govern." Fellow Republican strategist John Weaver tweeted in disgust, after Plan B went down, that Boehner is stuck with the impossible task of "herding cats on crack."

It appears that the cats haven't grasped the lesson of that Lincoln movie, which reminds us that compromise is the oil in the governing engine. In the absence of compromise, the engine breaks down. Without a year-end budget deal, two million Americans will immediately lose their federal jobless benefits, and middle-class taxes will rise (among other consequences). And all the polls agree that if we do a cliff dive, congressional Republicans will get the brunt of the blame.

So why are these House people behaving so self-destructively?

Many hail from safe districts where conservative voters dominate. Norman Ornstein, scholar at the conservative American Enterprise Institute, calls these districts "homogeneous echo chambers." The incumbents are virtually guaranteed reelection - as long as they toe the conservative line. If they were to compromise, they risk being challenged in primaries. As the purist group Club for Growth remarked last week, "the only thing that motivates members of Congress is fear of losing their jobs."

Actually, there is one other big motivator: slavish fealty to the one-percenters who bankroll the party - and who are hostile to paying higher taxes.

So says Mike Lofgren, who spent 16 years as a Republican senior analyst on the House and Senate budget committees. He saw the party's fealty to the rich up close. He quit last year because, in his words, "my own party, the Republican party, began to scare me." From his new book:

"The GOP cares, over and above every other item on its political agenda, about the rich contributors who keep them in office. This is why tax increases on the wealthy have become an absolute Republican taboo.... The GOP's mission is to protect and further enrich America's plutocracy. The party's caterwauling about deficits and debt is so much eyewash to blind the public."

The crisis of governance might be alleviated if more Republicans spoke that way. Hopefully, some absolutists are still reachable. They should heed Mark McKinnon: "We become a stronger Republican party by acting like reasonable human beings who acknowledge reality."

http://www.philly.com/philly/opinion/20121228_The_American_Debate__All_reason_leaves_the_GOP.html



Offline joan1984

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Reply #1 on: December 29, 2012, 06:52:19 PM
Not one elected Republican ran on a promise to follow whatever Democrats propose, even when Democrats propose nothing, propose only dead on arrival ideas, and zero reduction in spending, with a raise the taxes on those we say only, and down the road, we might have a discussion on spending, but then again, everything you believe is wrong, so maybe not.

The House of Representatives was determined during the same election as President Obama's reelection with fewer votes than he had on his first election in 2008. Republicans were elected as the House Majority, and have the mandate to carry forward the principles they espoused when elected, and not one of them ran on a "raise taxes" platform.

The ending of the "Bush Tax Cuts" is something every House and Senate Democrat Leader has espoused, and in fact did not vote to institute back when Bush proposed them, and insisted on these taxes reverting to Clinton levels for all in 2010. Every one of the prominent elected Democrats and Democrat Party, House and Senate leaders voted against the tax reductinon, and voted to force their demise in 10 years, refusing efforts to make them permanent for anyone.

The Sequestration process was agreed to by both parties and the President, and completes the deal made and agreed to, reduction of spending in order to gain agreement to raise the Debt Ceiling in August of 2011, after the President's refusal to negotiate specific cuts at that time, creating the crisis and dragging down the Nations credit rating. Any reasonable give to reduce spending and get our debt under control for the future could have avoided any rating change unless such a change had nothing to do with a stronger economic future for the United States at all.

Despite avoiding any agreement through the phony delaying tactics used to drag out the spending cuts, President Obama continues to demagogue the agreed to spending cuts, even as he demands a blank check for 5 years so as to continue his profligate ways.
Weak knee Senators may find the weasel words to kind of, sort of agree to mush, to be detailed later, on New Year's Day when they next meet.

House Republicans should not hold a vote to raise taxes. Period. President Obama should get his wish, the one he has espoused since he was selected Senator, and get his Clinton tax rates. He should get what he agreed to while trying to agree to nothing in August 2011, and implement the Sequestration of 100B + annually, only half of which comes from non-defense spending, and non of which comes from entitlement spending.

If the Obama Economy cannot withstand the Obama Sequestration and the Obama goal for Clinton Administration level tax rates, perhaps the Obama Economy needs to revisit Clinton Administration level Spending Limits. Time to Lead, Mr. President and Mr. President Elect.

What is it with the Executive Order giving VP Joe Biden at $5000 annual raise? Watch what he does, not what he says.
« Last Edit: December 29, 2012, 06:54:21 PM by joan1984 »

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Offline Gina Marie

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Reply #2 on: December 30, 2012, 12:10:16 AM



Offline Katiebee

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Reply #3 on: December 30, 2012, 06:23:45 AM
I am disgusted that the Republicans are demonstrating that not only are they not interested in really governing, but are actively trying to destroy the middle-class.

There are three kinds of people in the world. Those who can count, and those who can't.


Offline watcher1

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Reply #4 on: December 30, 2012, 03:53:38 PM
I am disgusted that the Republicans are demonstrating that not only are they not interested in really governing, but are actively trying to destroy the middle-class.

Politicians of both parties only care about the middle class when it suits their needs. We are just pawns to them.

Emancipate yourself from mental slavery, none but ourselves can free our minds.


Offline joan1984

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Reply #5 on: December 30, 2012, 04:05:29 PM
I am disgusted that the Republicans are demonstrating that not only are they not interested in really governing, but are actively trying to destroy the middle-class.

There are no, nada, zero, none, zippo Tax Cuts that have been proposed by anyone.
All Americans are budget bound in 2013 to lose the so called Bush Tax Cuts, which back in 2001 or whenever were a "cut", taking the high Clinton (raised on middle class) tax rates, and rolling them back just a little to help the economy recover from the Clinton recession.

Since 2001 and 2003, the current rates are just that, the prevailing tax rates for the past 10 plus years, and a Tax Increase is what Democrats insisted upon then, and extended in 2010, but insist upon now. American taxpayers have not reduced a Income Tax Cut in well over ten years, and we are due not just an extension, but a reform so as to see a reduction for each taxpayer into the future.

The President will get what he has bargained for, and nothing more. We will get stiffed by the Senate refusal to vote on many House passed bills from the last two years, so as to avoid progress, or putting President Obama into a position to actually sign or refuse to sign legislation.
« Last Edit: December 30, 2012, 04:54:03 PM by joan1984 »

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Offline Gina Marie

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Reply #6 on: December 30, 2012, 11:36:50 PM



Athos131

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Reply #7 on: December 31, 2012, 03:56:19 AM
I am disgusted that the Republicans are demonstrating that not only are they not interested in really governing, but are actively trying to destroy the middle-class.

It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault. 

It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault. 

It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  .





Offline bkpker

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Reply #8 on: January 03, 2013, 02:43:07 AM
Give the democrats complete  control and the country would go completely south.
It is time the politicians start looking at what is best for America and not one group or another.



Offline joan1984

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Reply #9 on: January 03, 2013, 03:28:32 AM
Listen to me, Athos: DO NOT "QUOTE" ME then substitute your drivel. Stop it.

I am disgusted that the Republicans are demonstrating that not only are they not interested in really governing, but are actively trying to destroy the middle-class.

It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault. 

It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault. 

It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  .




Some people are like the 'slinky'. Not really good for much,
but they bring a smile to your face as they fall down stairs.


Offline Gina Marie

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Reply #10 on: January 03, 2013, 03:31:39 AM
Listen to me, Athos: DO NOT "QUOTE" ME then substitute your drivel. Stop it.

Looks like a "legal" troll to me... I can't call him on a foul here...



Athos131

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Reply #11 on: January 03, 2013, 03:38:10 AM
I'M MAD BECAUSE MY TROLLING IS BEING MADE FUN OF.

I am disgusted that the Republicans are demonstrating that not only are they not interested in really governing, but are actively trying to destroy the middle-class.

It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  

It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  

It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  It's Obama's fault.  .




« Last Edit: January 03, 2013, 04:07:51 AM by Athos131 »