After Ferguson, we don't need another dialogue on race

[Katiebee]

Even Barry Goldwater said that abortion is not a republican/conservative issue. It's a personal issue.

You remember Barry Goldwater?  He lost the election for president because he said he would send more troops to Vietnam while LBJ promised no American boys would fight on Asian soil.  lol  He told the truth, LBJ lied.

In political analysis, Goldwater was truer to the conservative vein that most current conservatives. And I only know Goldwater from history. He is a major conservative American political philosopher.

LBJ was doomed it put American troops into Vietnam. He didn't want to, but was forced to in order to satisfy Republican and Democrat views of proper execution of the cold war. Democratic opposition to Vietnam did not congeal until the Marches on Washington. Even then, Republicans as well were starting to feel the political pressure to withdraw from Vietnam. It was never correctly put as a threat to U.S. security, it was all too theoretical for mom and pop in Iowa.

The problem was that we were too Communist phobic at the end of WWII, and rebuffed the overtures of Ho Chi Minh, who had a strong admiration for Jefferson. It was possible that if the U.S. had NOT supported France's effort to regain it's Indochina colonies, that Ho Chi Minh would have instituted a less extreme version of communism, more of a democratic socialism, like Sweden, and been a U.S. ally in the long run.

[phtlc]

phtlc, what can one expect from a catphobic submissive male?

Phobic! I don't fear the cats! I've trained my body and mind my whole life for the day they rise up against humanity and decency, and trust me....I'm ready!

Bring it on kitties! 

[Lois]

[phtlc]

It is not the size of the cat that one must fear, but the evil intent behind their agenda.

[oscarlong]

I finally agree with you wholeheartedly pthlc! Evil vile creatures. One of the few animals as destructive and nasty as humans

[Katiebee]

Dogs are social.

Cats are sociopaths.

[GEMINIGUY]

Cats aren't as messy.

[phtlc]

Dogs are social.

Cats are sociopaths.

I love you

[phtlc]

Cats aren't as messy.

I hate you

[GEMINIGUY]

Hey, no one ever said Butthead had to love Beavis.
Hehe hehe hehe
Of course you say you hate me because you know i'm right. A cat may claw your furniture. A dog tears it to shreds, along with the throw pillows. You put the cat out and she comes back just as clean. You put a dog out, he comes back covered in mud and his own shit. Why do dogs roll in their own shit???

[Katiebee]

To hide their smell as they stalk their prey.

However, I am at a loss as to why certain politicians roll in their own shit.

[Bexy]

The 'problem' with police is the same as with other things. Bad drives out good.
First of all, most police forces are pretty good, with well motivated men in the majority. Even now. But, think on it. The power must really appeal to jerks. You will always have these.

The problem lies with leftist media and politicians who sift through this stuff, looking for an incident they can lie about. Thus, you get your Zimmerman, Wilson, etc. Yet even in a poisoned atmosphere, they were acquitted. The current narrative is that white policemen are using blacks for target practice. It's a huge conspiracy man! It's bullshit.

What it succeeds in doing is driving out the good men from police work, who do not want lives and families destroyed by haters for just doing their job. It also results in bad neighborhoods being abandoned and ignored, because anything like real enforcement will only result in headlines and hate directed at the police and charges against them. There is no incentive for good police to do a good job, so the system drives out good and attracts bad.

I have to admit, police have become worse. We see it because 1. their role has changed to revenue gatherer, and 2. its way easier to give soccer moms and middle aged guys in their kid filled vans tickets. It's much easier pushing around harmless folks than facing hardened criminals. The soccer mom or middle aged dad isn't gonna pull a gun, or start a chase, or put a hit out on you.

If we want good police, we need to honor and respect them, and stop demonizing them.

[Katiebee]

No, I disagree, Bexy.

You have to have a force that is NOT envied with an us versus them mentality, where they close ranks around the corrupt cops, where they are not held accountable, where their professional ethics are on a par with our military.

Some police think they are entitled, to bribes, kick-backs, or the ability to be beyond the law they enforce. That is what is wrong. The good ones are protecting the bad ones, because of a false idea that they have to have solidarity with their brothers. That is wrong. You cannot have a group police themselves, it leads to abuses.

[oscarlong]

No, I disagree, Bexy.

You have to have a force that is NOT envied with an us versus them mentality, where they close ranks around the corrupt cops, where they are not held accountable, where their professional ethics are BETTER than our military.

Some police think they are entitled, to bribes, kick-backs, or the ability to be beyond the law they enforce. That is what is wrong. The good ones are protecting the bad ones, because of a false idea that they have to have solidarity with their brothers. That is wrong. You cannot have a group police themselves, it leads to abuses.

Sorry I agreed with everything except what I had to fix above. The military hasnt shown great ethics lately either regarding sexual abuse, so the hope would be better than that.

Bexy, thats a pretty odd set of statements. The problem lies with the leftist media? There isnt much of that around that I can see. All news seems to have become more reactionary, thats true, and I would say it is largely in response to the tactics of a few particular conservative cretins (can you guess which ones?) that have polarized and sensationalized the medium coupled with the internet news that only wants the flashiest, small bit of a story that people can post on FB. Our country is becoming more stupid, we read less, know less, and so become more easy to manipulate and polarize. This doesnt benefit leftists though, it benefits the elite.

I think the police have actually gotten better. Granted there are some glaring negative occurrences like those in the news right now, and still much room for improvement, as always. However, I think the transparency of such reporting has also shown that these unusual cases actually have repercussions. Back in the 90s if a bad cop choked someone to death, there was no way anything would happen at all, and definitely there would be no nationwide discussion of the use of force. Now these things are right at the forefront where they should be, cameras are everywhere. The idea being that even as a cop you shouldnt get to be above the law. I think thats a positive step forward, and one that has only occurred because of the media highlighting it.

These things should give all cops pause in the use of force. They should think ahead about what they would do in a situation, about how much force is ok, about how else things can be resolved. And about what will happen if they get caught. That way idiots like the cop who shot that kid in the playground dont get repeated, and people like Zimmerman loose their ability to have a gun sooner rather than later. (And I think Zimmerman has proven a few times now that he was exactly the asshat everyone thought he was in the media, so using that stinking pile of turd as an example in your argument seems pretty tenuous. )

[phtlc]

You have to have a force that is NOT envied with an us versus them mentality, where they close ranks around the corrupt cops, where they are not held accountable, where their professional ethics are on a par with our military.

But is it really a force with that mentality or a select few? That sweeping generalization naturally tends to enforce the very mentality you described because it sends a message to all police that you think they are all bad due to the actions of certain members. Nobody remembers the many cops they had good or neutral experiences with. They just remember the bad one.

Some police think they are entitled, to bribes, kick-backs, or the ability to be beyond the law they enforce. That is what is wrong. The good ones are protecting the bad ones, because of a false idea that they have to have solidarity with their brothers. That is wrong. You cannot have a group police themselves, it leads to abuses.

That will never change so long as there is a police union, because not only do you not go against your union, you also never fail to show up in support. If you want to change that you will have to break the police union. The problem with that is that at least here in Canada, the police are part of the same public sector union as every other public sector worker, who will fear that they are next. Do you want to be the politician who stirs up that hornets nest?

[oscarlong]

Police unions here are entirely separate. Not refuting the other things you said, just wanted to state the difference here. The cops and the fire dept generally kind of detest each other

[phtlc]

Police unions here are entirely separate. Not refuting the other things you said, just wanted to state the difference here. The cops and the fire dept generally kind of detest each other

I wish that were the case here. When our garbage collectors went on strike, their union guys were breaking laws left and right, yet the cops did nothing because they are in the same union.

[_priapism]

Ella Jones Is Elected First Black Mayor of Ferguson


Ms. Jones is also the first woman to lead the Missouri city, which erupted in protests in 2014 after a white police officer shot and killed Michael Brown, a black teenager.